Crosswalk Performance Mega-thread

Discussion and feedback on Construct 2

Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 12:11 pm

Actually, cocos2d-js can export natively to iOS and Android (and other platforms), so if you know javascript and want to make native mobile apps, use that. You also have the option to use Lua, which is very easy to learn.

If you're too lazy to learn code/programming, stop moaning.
Last edited by vybr on Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:28 pm

Egyptoon wrote:All the powerful features of C2 + small APK size + stability + amazing performance = the best solution ever.
and it's not impossible! it can be done!

That should be how Cordova works on Android 5.0+. The only problem is the Android market share, which is only a matter of time.

I think it's naive if you expect a native engine to not have any bugs either - we have a lot of native experience from working with Construct Classic, and it is just as fraught with difficult problems. All platforms have bugs, and browsers aren't special in that regard.

Also I have seen Crosswalk games running at a perfectly smooth 60 FPS - I suspect the current Crosswalk bug is specific to certain devices or hardware configurations. If you have a problem on one device, you can't assume that all devices are equally affected.
Scirra Founder
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 1:48 pm

This post is to help others to decide what to choose for exporting. I'm talking only about current Android situation. It may change in the future, but I don't expect anything radical in the next 6 months.

Quick answer: go for the new Cocoon.

Long answer:
Last 5 months, I've spent many hours testing various crosswalk versions.
I've used C2 template to make a simple game for testing and here are latest results.

This "1 tiled background & 3 sprites" game is basically unplayable on 3 devices. Future crosswalk version should fix infamous v-sync lag, but it won't fix low fps on those devices. Gigabyte GSmart Guru G1 & Asus Fonepad 7 FE170CG might not be bestsellers, but Samsung Galaxy Tab 3 certainly was and it has a big market penetration. Two months ago it was over 5%, now it sits around 1.7%, good it's getting better. Still, those are a year old devices and won't go away quickly.

To sum it up.
It's a pity, there's no way to tell in the Google dev console to not support devices with webGL blacklisted GPU. From my testings those are problematic devices and turning the flag off doesn't help much. One option is to set higher Android OS version, but since Samsung Tab 3 and other can have KitKat version, it's useless. Another option is to allow only devices with OpenGL ES 3.0+ support, this should mean only devices with good gpu will run your game. This can be set via a simple plugin. Downside is it cuts off like 65% devices and that's too much.
So yeah, export with Crosswalk if
- you don't care the game will lag on 50%+ devices
- it will run good, but only on 35% devices (OpenGL ES 3.0+)
- it will run good, but only on 12% devices (Android OS 5.0+)
- your game has static background and mostly static sprites (i.e. logic game)

I want my game to work on at least 80% devices and of those devices if 20% or less have some problems it's still ok. Given the current situation I wouldn't recommend exporting with Crosswalk. Cocoon looks promising, though. I tested my game on that problematic Galaxy Tab 3 and it looks and runs good, plus half sized apk. Crosswalk might be viable option next year.
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:42 pm

i expect my games to run on adreno and mali gpus, others are not even being used anymore. powervxr is lost case, and tab3 uses also some crappy gpu. not a problem for me, today mostly 90% devices use mali/adreno.
Sea Monsters template - Isometric
Also includes 40 pages PDF of optimizations and "how-to" for your games, and how the "sea monsters" template was built. Follow link for details :)

sea-monsters-templates-and-assets_t162705
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 2:47 pm

First of all I'm so sorry for causing that headache, I promise this will be my last post on this thread.

@vybr
I'm learning it right now and I'm not too lazy, I'm not even a developer I'm 33 years old artist and have tons of other skills (that's exactly why i choose C2 because it allows me to implement those skills in making games instead of start learning coding from point zero), but no problem to add another one in coding to my list.

@Ashly
How many players are using Android 5.0+ ?!
I know that all platforms have bugs but not in performance which is the most important thing in making playable games.
What makes me so angry with this performance issue is the powerful of your AWESOME software, and you know that for sure, you made an amazing powerful software that can allow anyone to make any 2d game without limitations, so why you insist to destroy it ?!
As I know you worked so hard on Construct 3 from scratch, you started again from the beginning but with the same concept! again html5 games that run inside a web browser with no native export! You had the chance to correct C2 mistakes!
After many tests i performed (shown on this thread) I found that Crosswalk will never be a right solution for games, and using the same assets from my game with another game engine like Buildbox gives me a huge boost in performance with only 5mb APK size compared to 23mb with Crosswalk and every thing is working perfectly (ads and GooglePlay services) without using any plugins.
I uploaded all those test APKs with the html5 game i created in C2 and share it with the Intel XDK member as well as all the members of this forum to be sure that I'm not doing anything wrong, you can test them and compare the results.
Skia fix gives me a good results and i don't know when it'll be available to build with, but just trying buildbox (an example of a software with a native exporter) gives me perfect results so i came back asking again and again: Please make C2 export just like this for mobile phones, it worth all the time and efforts making this super important feature in C3.
every one can pay for it because it worth, you can also get a revenue share from our games.
So I'm here not to say that C2 is bad, it's Awesome and everybody knows that, it just needs native exporter, just one step to make it PERFECT 2d engine ever made.

I've no personal problems with any one here and i helped you a lot to make a fix with Intel and Google and so sorry for the "noise" i made :)
I'm in a silent mode now :D
Have a nice day.
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:17 pm

I agree, a native exporter for mobile must be present in C3, or at least something like CocoonJS (the new compiler)
if not, then the new C3 will be useless.. :(
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 7:33 pm

@xanxion No and no once again. Some people bought C2 to be able to do browser games only so do not speak for them. And second no, Native Exporter is not even near the "Ultimate Performance" whatever the hell that means.

Once again, stop spamming this thread with shit not related to Crosswalk.


Edit: Next time think before posting. it actually is faster than deleting pointless posts.
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 9:26 pm

saiyadjin wrote:i expect my games to run on adreno and mali gpus, others are not even being used anymore. powervxr is lost case, and tab3 uses also some crappy gpu. not a problem for me, today mostly 90% devices use mali/adreno.


Maybe, if you target top countries, like USA, Canada, Australia, UK, Germany..., I don't believe you can get anywhere near 90% globaly.
That test is stripped down to a minimum, 30 events, 3 sprites, 3 tiled backgrounds and low res 400x500px and from 9 devices - 3 unplayable, 6 good, but 2 of them didn't max fps, even at this low requirements.

The only usable statistics I could find is this
Mali and Adreno gpu's make 75% - if your game is more than 3 sprites & 3 backgrounds, you might want to remove their low end versions.
Adreno = versions 200 to 225 which supports up to OpenGL ES 2.0 - that's 7%
and Mali - sub 400 - 1%, and you we're down to 67%.
One third of all players can't play the game properly, maybe even more, because Mali-400 supports up to ES 2.0 and from the test results, we can see it could start loosing fps when adding more objects.

I think, to be sure it's best to support ES 3.0 and up, if you really want to go with Crosswalk.
Distribution of the OpenGL ES 3.0+ in the last 6 months - 2015
  • Jan - 30%
  • Feb - 31%
  • Mar - 32.5%
  • Apr - 34%
  • May - 36%
  • Jun - 37%
It could get to 50% by the end of 2015. What type of game you're making?
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Post » Sat Jun 06, 2015 10:04 pm

shinkan wrote:@xanxion No and no once again. Some people bought C2 to be able to do browser games only so do not speak for them. And second no, Native Exporter is not even near the "Ultimate Performance" whatever the hell that means.

Once again, stop spamming this thread with shit not related to Crosswalk.


Edit: Next time think before posting. it actually is faster than deleting pointless posts.




I was speaking for myself, not the community, i would like some better export options, so we can release our games and not just prototype them.
And i'm not spamming. I'm just pointing it out. - Some sort of CocoonJS exporter would be fine, and that's not native, but the performance is acceptable. There's just too many bugs and missing features, because its not made for C2. (but i'm hoping that the new Cocoon Compiler will fix that!)
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Post » Sun Jun 07, 2015 2:36 am

@Ashley you wrote:
1# I think it's naive if you expect a native engine to not have any bugs either - we have a lot of native experience from working with Construct Classic, and it is just as fraught with difficult problems. All platforms have bugs, and browsers aren't special in that regard.

2# Also I have seen Crosswalk games running at a perfectly smooth 60 FPS - I suspect the current Crosswalk bug is specific to certain devices or hardware configurations. If you have a problem on one device, you can't assume that all devices are equally affected.


1# Yeah, it´s naive, of course.... But you give not other solutions! ....about months! Thats a big problem for people that have plans (and naive from you!!!) I have weeks ago post my facebook-site here with screenshots about my projects. one of this projects: "Apocalypse Germany". My plan was to ride a little bit on the Mad Max Wave. Graphics.... Musiccomposing... Concepts.... All are done. And at the moment its very, very hard to work again on my projects when i don´t know, when this bad situation(s) are gone. Look at Steam the Game "Convoy".... What Indie-devs not have: TIME!!!!!!!! I work every day 3-5 hours to games make with C2, but actually it feels like "russian Roulette" (with six bullets ;) ) "No native exporter" ....its ok for me. But then give another way!

2#Serious, Ashley or is this argument a joke? I mean, ok i am sure when i make my game via crosswalk everywhere in this world it gives smartphones on this runs the game. but it brings nothing, when it was 10%. And watch on google playstore. When it not runs smoothie, the people give only One-Star and ruined the DevName/project.

EDIT: And yes, i am in the beta from cocoon, too. and it runs now very great!!!!!!!! But its not Scirra or Ashleys earning! This Thread here is from 27. feb. 2015.... The "Crosswalk Intel XDK experience" from 05. Apr. 2014 (with over 1122 posts and 65.325 Views!!!!!). In all this time have Ash us leave alone! No services (statements) about the future. But every and every again a lot of users here they have sayed: "Its your mistake" or "That are rants!" This edited part of my post is to this people and specially to Ash: SHAME ON YOU!!!!!!
p.s.: and no! This is not spamming, when other user post here about native exporters when this thread here 27 pages long and the solution is: With CW run it actually not good! Its but rather black despair!!!!!!!!!!!!
Last edited by BasicTribe on Mon Jun 08, 2015 2:55 am, edited 2 times in total.
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