Getting musicians involved: What is reasonable?

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Post » Tue Apr 01, 2014 9:36 am

If you never made music then better find someone that will do it for you. If you have good project you might find someone talented and with skills.

In regards to music made out of loops... meh. Making music means writing each single note for each voice in certain rhythmic patterns.
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Post » Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:38 pm

megatronx wrote:In regards to music made out of loops... meh. Making music means writing each single note for each voice in certain rhythmic patterns.
I have seen the definition of "making music" change at least once before. The possibility of it doing so again is highly likely even if it does amount to putting pre-made blocks of sound in a specific order. It's not really unlike putting together a game in Construct vs actually coding a game.

I remember back in the late 70's/early 80's when synthesizers became really popular. The "real" musicians at the time were all up in arms about the possibility of other people making music without having to learn to play a real instrument. Nowadays, modern produced music is as altered and modified as an airbrushed supermodel on the cover of some magazine.

Don't get me wrong, I think if somebody wrote something using only loops, I would find it hard to call them a musician (I think orchestrator would be more appropriate if anything at all) . But at the same time, I have recognized loops in songs that I have heard on the radio by very famous/popular "artists"...
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Post » Tue Apr 01, 2014 3:37 pm

I'm very sorry if I started a discussion about loop based apps. It wasn't my intention. I rather wanted to point out, that everyone should pay much more attention to music and sound in their games. It just isn't enough to throw together a few loops and call it a soundtrack. Maybe this eaxample makes it clearer what I mean:

Imagine you're looking Star Wars in a cinema of your choice. Feels just right, doesn't it? And now imagine the same but without Williams' score and instead a few loops mixed together. Where's the connection to the film? Where are the unique recognizable themes, when using loops that thousands of other people also use?

Music should be much more than just a quick tailored placeholder, just so that it isn't so quiet. You would wonder how much more success your game had if using explicitly composed music instead of well konwn loops.

That doesn't mean loop based music wouldn't have its charme (I myself love doing remixes), it just isn't the right tool for games, where originality always wins. It isn't composing, it's editing/mixing what's already there. And that doesn't flatter the game. After all the work with high quality graphics, smooth animations and intense game logic a game deserves the same attention for the music!
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Post » Tue Apr 01, 2014 6:03 pm

jbickel wrote:
megatronx wrote:In regards to music made out of loops... meh. Making music means writing each single note for each voice in certain rhythmic patterns.
I have seen the definition of "making music" change at least once before. The possibility of it doing so again is highly likely even if it does amount to putting pre-made blocks of sound in a specific order. It's not really unlike putting together a game in Construct vs actually coding a game.

I remember back in the late 70's/early 80's when synthesizers became really popular. The "real" musicians at the time were all up in arms about the possibility of other people making music without having to learn to play a real instrument. Nowadays, modern produced music is as altered and modified as an airbrushed supermodel on the cover of some magazine.

Don't get me wrong, I think if somebody wrote something using only loops, I would find it hard to call them a musician (I think orchestrator would be more appropriate if anything at all) . But at the same time, I have recognized loops in songs that I have heard on the radio by very famous/popular "artists"...


Yeah, they had looped tapes already on the beatles albums. But they were using them creatively. And synths still needed to be controlled manually. Most mainstream artists back then were making their own sequences. I also don't think orchestrator is appropriate at all :D Orchestration is super hard! I know that mainstream is using loops taken from popular songs and that sux. We don't move forward at all because of them. Anyway, if loops it what is appropriate to do at particular moment, then let it be so.
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Post » Tue Apr 01, 2014 6:34 pm

thomas0611 hey man! I'm a composer too and my view on music is always extremely serious but...
It heavily depends on your situation whether you should hire a badass composer or just search for some free music via google. Sometimes it can be that simple. Just try to avoid copyrighted stuff. :)

Agree with sqiddster, NG is one of great places either for searching free music or composers.
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Post » Tue Apr 01, 2014 7:31 pm

jbickel wrote:
tulamide wrote:For me, I guess the bottom line is that bad music is probably better than no music (as long as there is a readily available mute button).

No. Sometimes bad music is the worst option. Even if the mute button is found, it's still a registered negative.

But some amateur 'musicians' do have an inflated ego of the amateur trade. In many cases, if you did a simple beginner's keyboard melody, that's plenty (and often better than the garbage amateur games have). Just a few simple bars is often enough.
If not, then there's plenty of places to get free sound tracks for your work.

You shouldn't need to go the paid musician route, unless you're a professional (proven) commercially profitable concern, with A grade products.
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Post » Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:44 pm

@megatronx - I couldn't think of a better word for it at the time. Maybe director? Either way, I think your "let it be so" comment sums it up. I mean, loops are out there, and there isn't really anything anybody can do about it. Might as well make the most of it...

@Aurora - Hey now... I said probably better. ;) Haha...maybe make the game mute by default?

@thomas0611 - I would think you should consider what genre of music you need first. That could certainly narrow down where you need to search for music/musicians.
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Post » Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:20 am

Do what I did, go to soundcloud, start listening to peoples creations and when you find someone you like(think his style would fit your game, etc.) send them a message telling them you would like to bring them onboard for your project. Be sure to state clearly that you can't offer them any money hands down, but that if the game makes any money(I olso suggest you include the phrase "and realisticaly it probably won't" so as to not get their hopes up) they will recieve their share.
At the end of the day if nothing else at least they will have their name in the credits and something new to add to their portfolio.

That's how I found myself a very talented mate who is gonna make some awesome music for my game. Hopefully after I release the game I will be able to reward his hard work...
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Post » Thu Apr 03, 2014 4:57 pm

tulamide wrote:Music should be much more than just a quick tailored placeholder, just so that it isn't so quiet. You would wonder how much more success your game had if using explicitly composed music instead of well konwn loops.

Exactly. I think people are misunderstanding you. This is what you mean by "loops", right?

Whereas this is a remix. Even though it is done using "loops", they are two different things.
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Post » Mon May 12, 2014 12:37 am

You can usually find composers on game development/engine forums. Scirra's Job Offers and Team Requests subforum has plenty of composers offering paid and free services, including myself.

That is, of course, only the best course of action if you want to have an exclusive soundtrack: if not, there are sites with free music or at least, selling licenses to royalty free music.
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