Online/Networking?

New releases and general discussions.

Post » Wed Nov 14, 2007 3:28 pm

why not just make it one of the options? when a better option becomes available/known, just go with that!
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Post » Wed Nov 14, 2007 6:00 pm

[quote="Ashley":3het8pmn]Raknet looks good and is free for non-commercial use, which means I could make a plugin using it and distribute it for free. However anyone wanting to sell their online game needs a license, which is only about 50 ($100) per application. This is okay I guess, a commercial game would probably make that back if they just have a handful of sales. But it's still a bit of a barrier to small time indie devs. What do you reckon?[/quote:3het8pmn]
I think $100 would be totally OK for a commercial project. And probably it would be possible to arrange a discount for Construct users (you're actually pushing their product to the market).

Besides, other people wold be free to code a brand new free extension..

Just a matter of quality of netcode, protocol etc., which I'm definitely not able to judge! 8)
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Post » Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:32 am

I think it's a good idea, yeah. At 1.0 if noone else has, I'll make a Raknet plugin. 50 does suck if you're a teenager, but I guess it'd have to be an investment if you plan to go commercial and have nothing. For everyone else, it's a small price to pay to go commercial. And yes, if someone comes up with something better and completely free, everyone wins :)

I'll have a shot around 1.0 time, and when I do, I'll contact the Raknet guy and see if we can get some kind of deal.
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Post » Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:37 am

for online capability, i'd like the option to connect people to each other directly and not through servers for some games. it makes sense to connect to a server for persistent world games like mmorpgs but for fighting games it makes more sense to connect people directly, client to client.
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Post » Thu Nov 15, 2007 5:12 am

The Raknet license is a single application license. It means that you have to pay $100 for each game that you release commercially.

Having thought about it, there is a considerable amount of time between the release of each commercial game, which would not be a problem.

I agree that if nothing else is done, then a Raknet plugin is a great idea, as we don't want Ashley spending all his time on a network plugin. (ah time ... the most difficult of luxuries to aquire).
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Post » Thu Nov 15, 2007 5:25 am

I have also been investigating the UDP issue. I mentioned earlier that UDP is fast but less reliable than TCP (and Raknet is a UDP library).

However, I have investigated further and it appears they have solved this issue. Here is a quote from the Raknet documentation:

[quote:1ctdgbnt]Unreliable
Unreliable packets are sent by straight UDP. They may arrive out of order, or not at all. This is best for data that is unimportant, or data that you send very frequently so even if some packets are missed newer packets will compensate.
Advantages - These packets don't need to be acknowledged by the network, saving the size of a UDP header in acknowlegement (about 50 bytes or so). The savings can really add up.
Disadvantages - No packet ordering, packets may never arrive, these packets are the first to get dropped if the send buffer is full.

Reliable
Reliable packets are UDP packets monitored by a reliablilty layer to ensure they arrive at the destination.
Advantages - You know the packet will get there. Eventually...
Disadvantages - Retransmissions and acknowlegements can add significant bandwidth requirements. Packets may arrive very late if the network is busy. No packet ordering.
[/quote:1ctdgbnt]
There are also options for packet sequencing, so packets arrive in the right order.

All in all, I think this is a good fast solution, especially in terms of development time required.

My only issue is the licensing, but hey, things cost money ;)
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Post » Thu Nov 15, 2007 1:47 pm

Solved what issue? UDP just sends a message and waves it goodbye. TCP sends a message and waits for the receiver to confirm they got it so you guarantee arrival, which is slower since you have to wait for the confirmation, etc. That's a bit of a simplification, but that's essentially it. If you recreate that guarantee with UDP, what have you gained? Haven't you just reinvented the wheel (TCP)?

I don't know much about networking though, so maybe there is some kind of advantage.
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Post » Fri Nov 16, 2007 9:17 am

Well if you are going to Use Raknet, which is a UDP library, you are going to need some way to send guaranteed packets (for somethings and non-guaranteed for others). My concern was that because Raknet is a UDP library that it would not have a way to send guaranteed packets ... however it does.

This is a good thing, if you are going to use Raknet.

I am all for using TCP for guaranteed packets though if you are going to include that in the plugin.
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Post » Fri Nov 16, 2007 11:47 am

Oh okay, good, Raknet seems to have it all covered then :)
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Post » Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:28 pm

Raknet looks very good. Has anyone got any plans or the skills to make this extension? What would it involve? How hard would it be to plug in the Rakkarsoft API into a construct extension?

This extension would truely make construct.
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