Proposed licensing model

Discussion and feedback on Construct 2

Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:41 pm

Um, I thought you'd follow the Unity way but still I like everything about this plan, since I'll be using mostly the free version till I get a credit card :)

But still one thing that bugs me is that there's no windows exporter in the free version, or, will there be one? :)

Since most others tools have the windows exporter for free and most of the hobbyist game makers who make QUALITY games for free are actually looking for that. (I capped Quality because the HTML5 is pretty limited right now, not much eye candy)

EDIT: Will the nag screen in the free version depend on how much time we have used it? Like we have to wait for 5 sec one day to close the nag screen and 6 sec the next day.
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:44 pm

[quote="zeno":640zbbae]It also seems a bit odd going from a free software to one where you pay more than Game Maker but then 2 years later don't actually own it.[/quote:640zbbae]
That's what I also thought. It just makes it sort of greedy.

It's like you first make it as a free alternative for MMF2 and after 10'000 People use this, you just turn this into a subscribe program to cash in. This makes me feel really betrayed, even if the reason would be that you make Construct as a full-time job.

It would be better if you do this like Clickteam does. You pay for the software and when another major update comes out, users owning the old version get a discount. This makes the user decide, if he really wants to jump to a newer version or if he's happy with the software he just has. That's how lots of major software developers do.

But as said, I feel betrayed by having something free and later have to pay to still use it. :|
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:48 pm

[quote="zeno":2u1ee3o0]I would be happy to support Scirra with a payment of 150 etc but only if i actually owned the software after that. With subscriptions it just seems like a large donation with bonuses but time limited so i actually much prefer the system Clickteam etc use than that idea.[/quote:2u1ee3o0]

If you're revenue from using the commercial license was the minimum (20000/yr) then your Construct 2 related business expense would be at the very most 0.375% of your revenue. The more you make, the smaller that percentage gets. And at least in my country, that expense comes off every year at tax time anyway as a business expense, so it's essentially free.
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:53 pm

We're not just talking about the price.
The reason is, that after 2 years, the subscription runs out and the software isn't yours anymore.

Also, we're not all companies that yearn 20'000 Pounds per year. We're talking mostly about normal earning people.
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 6:57 pm

[quote="Neo1000":1wbhxacq]We're not just talking about the price.
The reason is, that after 2 years, the subscription runs out and the software isn't yours anymore.

Also, we're not all companies that yearn 20'000 Pounds per year. We're talking mostly about normal earning people.[/quote:1wbhxacq]

So you can't afford 1.66 a month? That's what it works out to. Besides you can still then use it - you just won't get updated?
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:02 pm

[quote="liamdawe":j4yfv77h]So you can't afford 1.66 a month? That's what it works out to. Besides you can still then use it - you just won't get updated?[/quote:j4yfv77h]

I know, right? There's people complaining about something that costs less than what their grandmother probably spends annually for her knitting hobby.

Like I said before, still one of the cheapest hobbies to have. And if you make a business out of it, deduct the expense from your taxes.
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:15 pm

[quote="Neo1000":27wnkphq][quote="zeno":27wnkphq]It also seems a bit odd going from a free software to one where you pay more than Game Maker but then 2 years later don't actually own it.[/quote:27wnkphq]
That's what I also thought. It just makes it sort of greedy.

It's like you first make it as a free alternative for MMF2 and after 10'000 People use this, you just turn this into a subscribe program to cash in. This makes me feel really betrayed, even if the reason would be that you make Construct as a full-time job.

It would be better if you do this like Clickteam does. You pay for the software and when another major update comes out, users owning the old version get a discount. This makes the user decide, if he really wants to jump to a newer version or if he's happy with the software he just has. That's how lots of major software developers do.

But as said, I feel betrayed by having something free and later have to pay to still use it. :|[/quote:27wnkphq]
i think its good idea,
mmf2 cost 150 eur that would be like 5 years of construct with free updates.
and game maker's limitation to export to mobile phones by an user ( asuming construct will have mobile phone exporters) is much more expensive then those 40 coins.
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:21 pm

@liamdawe, deebee
The price is sort of ok. But! You own it only 2 years long. It's like if I would give you a software and after one year I take it away from you. I never liked subscription plans and I still don't like it.

Also deebee, if I want I could actually learn a programming language and program for [u:15454vrq]free[/u:15454vrq]. And if I learn like C# or Lua, I won't be bound with just the exporters Construct has. Yes, it's cheap.

This is the biggest difference
While with 150 Euro I can only have Construct fully for 5 years. I can spend 150 Euro for MMF2 and I can use it also after 20 years. Sure it's then old but I still can use it, because I own the software.
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:23 pm

I've edited the original outline: I think it's fair that any official exporters developed will not be charged for separately, so your 2 years license will cover, for example, a desktop runtime (if we make one).

There will not be any splash screens in what you create. There are two reasons for this: firstly, it really annoys a lot of people (it's nice some of you think it's fair, but a lot of people have been vocal about this in the other thread). Secondly, with all the javascript being open, it's probably pretty trivial to remove any splashes we put in, so if you're paying to remove a splash, you may well feel ripped off seeing demo users regularly tweaking the javascript to get rid of it.

I also think it's fair that once your license expires, you don't get any nag screens, you can continue to use the software in a sort of "frozen" state (no more updates). No point nagging people who have paid.

Some users get up in arms when asked to pay to upgrade to a next major version, even with discounts - I don't think there's any system we can come up with that isn't going to offend someone or other. I'm happy to stick with subscription, and providing official exporters for free should make that a better deal for you guys.

[quote="Neo1000":3pa9q314]That's what I also thought. It just makes it sort of greedy.

It's like you first make it as a free alternative for MMF2 and after 10'000 People use this, you just turn this into a subscribe program to cash in. This makes me feel really betrayed, even if the reason would be that you make Construct as a full-time job.[/quote:3pa9q314]
I'm sorry, but this kind of annoys me. Three of us spend over three years developing Construct 0.x in our spare time - it's about a quarter of a million lines of code - and we've not really made any money (donations just about neatly cover hosting cost and that's all). It's been tonnes of work and we did it because we really like programming. I'm sorry that we are disappointing you by moving to paid software. However, we're only asking for approximately one day's wages every two years and also making allowance to use the software entirely for free on the condition you click away a dialog every now and then, and I can't help but feel that deal is perfectly fair for everyone.
Scirra Founder
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Post » Sun Feb 27, 2011 7:28 pm

So far there's only two models that have been looked at, open source, and commercial.
The thing is you've had no success in either thus far.
Construct 0.xx failed commercially because... well we wont go into that here, and it also failed as open source because it never received the full benefit of being open source.
If you plan on just using those two possibilities, then you need to make a final decision on what you want to get out of it.
Either a program that's completely community driven, or one that's driven monetarily.

It would seem you've already made the decision, but I think is far too early to be thinking about licensing, since you don't have a salable product.
The recent HTML5 addition to Gm should really drive that point across.

That and the fact that there's very little revenue, or finished projects from Construct 0.xx.
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