[REQUEST] Expert Mode

Post » Thu Mar 30, 2017 1:48 pm

(I'll count myself as an expert in as well).

To be honest, I don't mind the text in the blank event sheet at first, since from the moment you add an event to it, it disappears and is not to be seen again.
It is like a graffiti in the empty event sheet, and even adding a comment makes it go away.

As for the tooltip/field helpers, they are freaking helpful and preventing from having to go dive in the manual for a quick refresher when needed.
Especially for the kind of objects you don't use everyday, or come back to later in your development.

Sure for common actions/conditions they are "useless" after a while, but honestly it is easy to focus on the field(s) and not even pay attention to the small line on top of it.

I think the suggestion of having them grayed is actually giving them more focus on top of making them harder to read if you want/need to, which in the end defeats both purposes.
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Post » Thu Mar 30, 2017 4:10 pm

Ashley wrote:Well, like I said, I made the software (hopefully that counts me as an expert user?) and I still think it's handy to have them there. For example when you focus the Volume parameter of a Play Sound action... is it in dB or a ratio? Positive or negative? Honestly, sometimes I even coded it and can't remember what I did. The tip clears it up: it's dB attenuation, so ought to be negative, or 0 for full volume. That kind of thing is always useful IMO, whoever you are.


@Ashley
I've never, ever done that, because I read that it was dB and have never forgotten it's dB. Or that X/Y coordinates start in the top left. Or what # IDs represent what buttons on a gamepad. I can't imagine anyone who's spent a significant amount of time with Construct or other development software not being able to do the same. I understand your point (somewhat) but at the same time, I run Photoshop, Illustrator, After Effects, 3DSMAX, etc. with the interface hidden 99% of the time, that software all has quite a bit more to remember than Construct hotkey-wise, and it's never been an issue. Less clutter is always good, and unnecessary text is clutter. Plus, you've already got a "Help" button plastered across every feature, so is it really that much of a concern to constantly remind people if they don't want to be reminded?

As someone said above, it seems to be a target audience thing. Hence the request for a separate mode for a more advanced audience. "Always" is a strong word, because it's not really always when you just want a reminder on occasion. I wouldn't really mind C3 looking a bit less like a beginner's toy and having large prominent help text every step of the way going all Microsoft Paperclip on users isn't helping.
Last edited by digitalsoapbox on Fri Mar 31, 2017 5:00 pm, edited 6 times in total.
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Post » Thu Mar 30, 2017 4:12 pm

Kyatric wrote:(I'll count myself as an expert in as well).

To be honest, I don't mind the text in the blank event sheet at first, since from the moment you add an event to it, it disappears and is not to be seen again.
It is like a graffiti in the empty event sheet, and even adding a comment makes it go away.

As for the tooltip/field helpers, they are freaking helpful and preventing from having to go dive in the manual for a quick refresher when needed.
Especially for the kind of objects you don't use everyday, or come back to later in your development.

Sure for common actions/conditions they are "useless" after a while, but honestly it is easy to focus on the field(s) and not even pay attention to the small line on top of it.

I think the suggestion of having them grayed is actually giving them more focus on top of making them harder to read if you want/need to, which in the end defeats both purposes.


@Kyatric
Kyatric wrote:(I'll count myself as an expert in as well).

To be honest, I don't mind the text in the blank event sheet at first, since from the moment you add an event to it, it disappears and is not to be seen again.
It is like a graffiti in the empty event sheet, and even adding a comment makes it go away.

As for the tooltip/field helpers, they are freaking helpful and preventing from having to go dive in the manual for a quick refresher when needed.
Especially for the kind of objects you don't use everyday, or come back to later in your development.

Sure for common actions/conditions they are "useless" after a while, but honestly it is easy to focus on the field(s) and not even pay attention to the small line on top of it.

I think the suggestion of having them grayed is actually giving them more focus on top of making them harder to read if you want/need to, which in the end defeats both purposes.


@Kyatric
I didn't ask for them to be greyed out. I asked for an option to hide them entirely although in an earlier user's post, if the grey was darkened a little bit, would be better than black text on solid white - right now the help text just kind of blends in with the editable form fields, so as it stands it's not as good as it could be in terms of visual clarity or defining a hierarchy of importance (help text is not as important as functionality). I don't need to be reminded of what "compare two values" does on a per-field basis. The name of the event is descriptive enough. While that's just one example, that extends across all events. If I get stuck, I can always turn them back on - maybe a hotkey toggles them? - or open the manual. Aside from needing to point out that not expecting people to read the manual is insanity, but that's another topic. Outside of being distracted by their prominence in C3, I can't remember the last time I actually read any of the hints. So it'd be nice to get rid of them. Maybe the CSS will be clean enough that it'll take just a few changes to hide them globally? That'd be good, if it's a feature that isn't going to be added in by default. Other than a dark skin, which is kind of expected these days because black on white is so hard on the eyes, that would be my first change once it's possible.

It's a pretty common feature in both development IDEs and many other widely-used applications that are designed for a broad audience made of both beginners and more experienced users. At a certain comfort level, users just don't need to be constantly reminded about what does what, y'know? Imagine if every time you rolled over an icon in Photoshop, it presented you with a highly-detailed description of what the tool does and what it's designed to be used for. That's what this feels like in C3.

Anyways, since C3 is in testing I figured I'd bring it up. I thought about mentioning it in C2 but with C3 being an IDE rewrite it made sense to wait. Obviously there are more pressing issues.
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Post » Fri Mar 31, 2017 12:45 am

Ashley wrote:Well, like I said, I made the software (hopefully that counts me as an expert user?) and I still think it's handy to have them there. For example when you focus the Volume parameter of a Play Sound action... is it in dB or a ratio? Positive or negative? Honestly, sometimes I even coded it and can't remember what I did. The tip clears it up: it's dB attenuation, so ought to be negative, or 0 for full volume. That kind of thing is always useful IMO, whoever you are.


Totally fair, and I agree, totally a matter of preference. And you of all of us are certainly most qualified for an expert mode discussion. I'd just cast my vote for having them optional, but if not, maybe something that displays them a little less coarsely. Appreciate the discussion.
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