So What Is Your Second Impression of C3 And Will You Buy?

Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:46 am

newt wrote:I don't mean to be a negative Nancy all the time, but "wait for c3 runtime" on all the most voted features on the new requests platform doesn't make me feel great.


Yup - it's quite depressing. Either 'wait until c3 runtime', or 'future consideration' (ie wait until after c3 runtime....) for things like scene graph and advanced particles. Approx 90% of suggestions have not been reviewed, which gives the impression that the suggestions platform has already been abandoned.
A big fan of JavaScript.
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 10:06 am

digitalsoapbox wrote:I've wondered about all of this too. It seems pretty backwards. Subscriptions kind of kill off most hobbyists. In the end I just decided they've shifted markets and are going for the educational dollar, not the developer dollar. Unless the new runtime is a lot farther along than they've announced. In which case waiting to release anything may have been better instead of a half-measure that breaks everything, and then will break everything again when it's updated at some unknown future date, so that's probably not it. It certainly makes any kind of long-term development plans by users unrealistic.

¯\_(ツ)_/¯


You are putting it in words very clearly. The multiple platforms and devices goal does look like it's being targeted towards an audience with tablets and chromebooks, not beefy machines or a workflow that will utilize a more production ready environment. Since special deals could be made with educational institutions, the subscription might even be a plus under these circumstances.

To me, it looks like the announcement and early release of C2.3 in it's current, transitional phase, might have been due to pressure from competitor software (Fusion 3 perhaps). Perhaps Scirra wanted to have the heads up in sales and deals, before other products hit the market. This makes me think that by the end of the year, around the time Fusion 3 will be available, C2.3 will be as stable as C2, with some more features. Perhaps the new run-time will follow soon after, or there will be a solid ETA by then... Perhaps.

However, as you already said, this is bad for hobbyist, and for the pros, this technology shift is unstable ground to invest time and money. Let's wait and see, only time will tell I guess...
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 11:14 am

"I can't believe Scirra chose a HTML5 runtime instead of Flash. It just doesn't make any sense. Everyone is doing everything in Flash so obviously that was what they should have done. Also they have started charging money when Construct Classic was free, especially when C2 is so early on at this stage of development compared to CC. Obviously this will drive away users. I think I'll choose another tool. HTML5 also only runs in Chrome and Firefox right now so it seems needlessly limited, and we don't know if other browsers will ever support it. It seems like it was a desparate afterthought. It's sad to see Scirra making such crazy choices. It seems like they'll just fade in to obscurity to be overtaken by other tools. Too bad they're doomed."

- Everyone in 2011
Scirra Founder
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:11 pm

Ashley wrote:"I can't believe Scirra chose a HTML5 runtime instead of Flash. It just doesn't make any sense. Everyone is doing everything in Flash so obviously that was what they should have done. Also they have started charging money when Construct Classic was free, especially when C2 is so early on at this stage of development compared to CC. Obviously this will drive away users. I think I'll choose another tool. HTML5 also only runs in Chrome and Firefox right now so it seems needlessly limited, and we don't know if other browsers will ever support it. It seems like it was a desparate afterthought. It's sad to see Scirra making such crazy choices. It seems like they'll just fade in to obscurity to be overtaken by other tools. Too bad they're doomed."

- Everyone in 2011


I think that was a good decision to switch to HTML5, but I don't know why you take so much credit for predicting that? I think a lot of us made that prediction about HTML5 being easier to use than Flash and it would eventually replace Flash. Maybe not on these forums. I wasn't around here then, but this was a popular opinion among us working in the web.

It was really Apple that gave a huge blow to Flash. I don't think too many people predicted that. (Thinking back, it makes sense. Apple does this often.) I think a lot of us thought that eventually people would switch to HMTL5, but it would be a long, and slow process. When people become comfortable with a product, it's harder for them to switch.

Flash isn't entirely dead yet either, btw. ActionScript is still being used, there's still games sites dedicated to Flash games, CNN and other major news sites still use Flash to show videos, there are still Flash ads around (IMDB), etc. Flash is now called Animate CC, but you can still use ActionScript in it. The only thing is really dead is Flash websites. I haven't seen any of those for a while. But it was always bad practice to build a website entirely in Flash.

All those people who tried to convince you to use Flash, they probably haven't gone very far. Obviously, they aren't here, but I wouldn't be surprised they are still using Flash somewhere, if they haven't switched to HTML5 by now.
Last edited by Moot on Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:22 pm

As a quick aside, by far the most prevalent commercial use of Animate is in the creation of banner ads and rich web media content, of which HTML5 and canvas are the dominant background tech thanks in no small part to the fact that Animate is the amalgamation of several Adobe programs, namely Flash, Edge and Edge Animate.

With this in mind, it relies on the much more modern holy trinity of HTML5, CSS3 and JavaScript.

I think it would be a misrepresentation of Animate to lean too heavily on it's ActionScript and Flash aspects; whilst these do exit, in my opinion they're grandfathered in to capture the userbase left behind when Adobe discontinued Flash - and even these features are heavily dependent on AIR to survive in today's world.

God I miss Fireworks. I miss Fireworks so much.
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 5:56 pm

Elliott wrote:As a quick aside, by far the most prevalent commercial use of Animate is in the creation of banner ads and rich web media content, of which HTML5 and canvas are the dominant background tech thanks in no small part to the fact that Animate is the amalgamation of several Adobe programs, namely Flash, Edge and Edge Animate.

With this in mind, it relies on the much more modern holy trinity of HTML5, CSS3 and JavaScript.

I think it would be a misrepresentation of Animate to lean too heavily on it's ActionScript and Flash aspects; whilst these do exit, in my opinion they're grandfathered in to capture the userbase left behind when Adobe discontinued Flash - and even these features are heavily dependent on AIR to survive in today's world.

God I miss Fireworks. I miss Fireworks so much.


I agree with you. Animate CC is not Flash anymore. My point is that Flash is not completely dead yet. Although, I think it's near there now. My other point was that without Apple, Flash would still be pretty strong. I remember numerous companies coming out against Apple's decision to drop Flash and it was even a selling point for many competitors, that their devices can still view Flash. Eventually though, Apple users didn't miss Flash and other companies finally came a round.

I think I'm really just trying to put all this in perspective. When everyone disagrees with Ashley, he brings up the point that he predicted HTML5 would replace Flash, so we should just blindly trust his decisions because we just don't see it yet. I think that is a weak argument.
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:00 pm

I'd be willing to bet most people here use Construct in spite of it being html5 than because it is html5. I'm here for the event system. A lot of posts have been made vindicating the choice to use html5, but i feel regardless Scirra is still a bit blind to its down sides and the on going issues it presents. Just my opinion.
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:03 pm

Ashley wrote:"I can't believe Scirra chose a HTML5 runtime instead of Flash. It just doesn't make any sense. Everyone is doing everything in Flash so obviously that was what they should have done. Also they have started charging money when Construct Classic was free, especially when C2 is so early on at this stage of development compared to CC. Obviously this will drive away users. I think I'll choose another tool. HTML5 also only runs in Chrome and Firefox right now so it seems needlessly limited, and we don't know if other browsers will ever support it. It seems like it was a desparate afterthought. It's sad to see Scirra making such crazy choices. It seems like they'll just fade in to obscurity to be overtaken by other tools. Too bad they're doomed."

- Everyone in 2011


And obviously, mocking your user base isn't going to drive them away either.
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:04 pm

Nobody wanted flash. We talked about opengl, or directx, or maybe even a mobile native.
Talked/ fought.
Of course we then fought over html5, and were promised an exporter sdk.

Probably shouldn't start in on that one though.
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Post » Mon Apr 17, 2017 6:06 pm

Ethan wrote:I'd be willing to bet most people here use Construct in spite of it being html5 than because it is html5. I'm here for the event system. A lot of posts have been made vindicating the choice to use html5, but i feel regardless Scirra is still a bit blind to its down sides and the on going issues it presents. Just my opinion.


Good point.
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