The Construct, someday will support 3D?

New releases and general discussions.

Post » Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:20 am

[quote="Aeal5566":2dpxu548]
You do realize that EVERY 3d package exports to .obj right? [/quote:2dpxu548]

Of course I know that. I also know very few 3D engines will accept that format and instead use their own propriety format, or animation only from specific 3D packages (generally Maya or Max), I also know that not every 3D package exports to it in exactly the same way, which can result in incompatible files, plus the .obj file isn't the be all and end all that it used to be, there are better supported open source formats that provide more options and information saved, thus making them a more attractive prospect than the now very old wavefront object file. Hence my original point still stands.

[quote:2dpxu548]WOW thats not even true people love to play games that dont look photo realistic in fact people usually find it a nice change of pace. Okami, Braid and many other games that are not realistic looking at all people love those games.[/quote:2dpxu548]

Niche games and 15 minute wonders, they're good for a change but have no lasting appeal with the majority in this day and age of the "i want it now and it has to be cutting edge perfect" generation. It's a standard fact that this generation are on the whole, spoiled, and will always expected better and faster and more of it. Cult Classics of the past remain cult classics because of of the rose tinted memory effect of those who remember them, and the fact people were just easier to impress back then, plus as you get older you begin to appreciate substance over flashy visuals. It would be folly to even pretend a homebrew game done in a few weeks will ever have a chance of drawing attention away from the cutting edge games developed with millions of dollars, for more than a few minutes, from the spoiled generation. And it's a sad fact, but a fact all the same, that if you sat a typical user of the type I used as an example, and had them choose between something with very basic 3D and fantastic gameplay and something flashy and expensive looking but not so great gameplay. They're going to pick the latter, it's just how it is, just how they are. If you want lasting appeal, aim at the older generations, and those who don't make owning the best hardware the second it's released, their lives.


[quote:2dpxu548]No just no. Do you have ANY idea as to what goes into making a 3d game engine? The REASON they have all these different middle ware engines is because it was too time consuming and stupid to REMAKE the same thing over and over again. and if you can make an engine do what you want with recoding a bit of the source then they would always opt to do that. 500,000 lines of code to make it do what you want or 2,000,000 to build your own. not to mention the debugging time, the time it takes to learn how to interact with it all that as compared to relatively minor changes in a preexisting engine to make it do what you want.[/quote:2dpxu548]

Your talking about middleware, not complete solutions like I was talking about. Writing an engine from scratch does not mean not using middleware. :P

[quote:2dpxu548]have you used unity or any other 3d engine most of them are pretty intuitive..... especially unity.[/quote:2dpxu548]

Yes, I have. Except Unity, that's the only one I haven't used.
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Post » Sun Dec 20, 2009 5:54 am

[quote="Lost my Keys":7lpfdeln]
Your talking about middleware, not complete solutions like I was talking about. Writing an engine from scratch does not mean not using middleware. :P[/quote:7lpfdeln]

WTF is one of your complete solutions then? You can still edit the source and change what you need which is what happens most of the time. Writing your own game engine is stupid with all the free stuff you can use out there. and even if you had one of your complete solutions you would only make one game with it and then make another one? Good luck with that.

[quote="Lost my Keys":7lpfdeln]

Of course I know that. I also know very few 3D engines will accept that format and instead use their own propriety format, or animation only from specific 3D packages (generally Maya or Max), I also know that not every 3D package exports to it in exactly the same way, which can result in incompatible files, plus the .obj file isn't the be all and end all that it used to be, there are better supported open source formats that provide more options and information saved, thus making them a more attractive prospect than the now very old wavefront object file. Hence my original point still stands.[/quote:7lpfdeln]

Maya and max both are less likely to support some Open source format rather than .obj. Also directX has its own file type called .x i believe and .objs and other formats need to be converted to that before begin put into directx.


[quote="Lost my Keys":7lpfdeln]Niche games and 15 minute wonders, they're good for a change but have no lasting appeal with the majority in this day and age of the "i want it now and it has to be cutting edge perfect" generation. It's a standard fact that this generation are on the whole, spoiled, and will always expected better and faster and more of it. Cult Classics of the past remain cult classics because of of the rose tinted memory effect of those who remember them, and the fact people were just easier to impress back then, plus as you get older you begin to appreciate substance over flashy visuals. It would be folly to even pretend a homebrew game done in a few weeks will ever have a chance of drawing attention away from the cutting edge games developed with millions of dollars, for more than a few minutes, from the spoiled generation. And it's a sad fact, but a fact all the same, that if you sat a typical user of the type I used as an example, and had them choose between something with very basic 3D and fantastic gameplay and something flashy and expensive looking but not so great gameplay. They're going to pick the latter, it's just how it is, just how they are. If you want lasting appeal, aim at the older generations, and those who don't make owning the best hardware the second it's released, their lives.[/quote:7lpfdeln]

Im not talking about homebrew games even in the market most games you see have some degree of abstraction. Final fantasy, any wii game, the only realistic games you really see are sports games and war games other than that they are hyper realistic. and even then there are games that are just awesome looking and fun to play such as borderlands. I think you saying that only really realistic looking games are what people want to play is not true at all.
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Post » Sun Dec 20, 2009 6:42 pm

i was suggesting that an 3dobject loader would be great to bypass the vram limit, one model load and 1 texture, and then you could transform the objecto or maybe a timeline , rather than having different images-frames,

im working on a topdown space shooter, now if i want some tilting in the ships i need to setup a 3d model and render everything out, it quickly takes alot of vram, if i could manipulate the model ingame, i could make some great things and could be attached to events, and i would be happy if it only had a custom collision mask per object or something,

so its more of a 2d use of 3dobjects,in my opinion this is as far as i would go with 3d , for complexity reason.
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Post » Sun Dec 20, 2009 6:47 pm

There are engines that better support 3d and should be used for 3d games. I think there is a use for a 3d object loader. and if you run into vram load images from external files to save on the Vram.
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Post » Sun Feb 21, 2010 4:07 pm

the topic is little outdate, but I have sugestion how to make Construct fully 3d.

In the web you can finde many opensource 3d engines like "irrlicht" or "ogre"
There is a poular 2d game creator "game maker" , and someane once ported for it irrlicht 3d engine,
so why not ported this for Construct to.
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Post » Sun Feb 21, 2010 4:48 pm

[quote="kid":363eyyua]so why not ported this for Construct to.[/quote:363eyyua]

Because that's a ton of work.

And because Construct is a 2D game maker.
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Post » Sun Feb 21, 2010 5:11 pm

[quote="deadeye":1whjpro3][quote="kid":1whjpro3]so why not ported this for Construct to.[/quote:1whjpro3]

Because that's a ton of work.

And because Construct is a 2D game maker.[/quote:1whjpro3]

"Game Maker" is a 2D game maker too.
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Post » Sun Feb 21, 2010 5:50 pm

[quote="Genesys":1sxlygmp][quote="deadeye":1sxlygmp][quote="kid":1sxlygmp]so why not ported this for Construct to.[/quote:1sxlygmp]

Because that's a ton of work.

And because Construct is a 2D game maker.[/quote:1sxlygmp]

"Game Maker" is a 2D game maker too.[/quote:1sxlygmp]

<--- Runs off to make the next Crysis with Gamemaker... oh wait.
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Post » Sun Feb 21, 2010 5:58 pm

Programming is not as simple as copying and pasting irrlicht or ogre in to Construct and having it all work magically. It's a ton of work for us, requiring significant work and changes all the way through the codebase, and we're just volunteer, spare-time developers. Then there's a whole class of other problems, such as how will the UI and event system work applied to a 3D game? The answers are not clear, and there's no way we'd even start if we don't know what we're aiming for.
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Post » Sun Feb 21, 2010 6:04 pm

Besides 3D games already have several high-end engines, the development resources required for a decent modern result are massive and I suspect there's less people with the necessary skillset in the user base of such a "Friendly" tool like construct.

I think it's great that Construct is focusing on an awesome development platform for 2D while employing hardware acceleration and shaders. There's still plenty to improve as well, apart from adding 3D stuff.
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