XBOX ONE UWP performance?

Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 5:40 pm

NetOne wrote:thanks for the insight @digitalsoapbox

i dont get the 128 mb you are talking about,
MS says that UWP has access to 1 gig when real world deployed in forground mode (450MB when in dev mode)
Are you saying that we cant use more than 128 MB because construct games have to be able to handle a background mode and they cant?
cant the games just quit if not running in foreground?


The maximum memory available to an app running in the foreground is 1 GB.
The maximum memory available to an app running in the background is 128 MB.
Share of 2-4 CPU cores depending on the number of apps and games running on the system.
Share of 45% of the GPU depending on the number of apps and games running on the system.

https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/uwp/xbox-apps/system-resource-allocation

what I dont get is that with access to even these restricted specs and running through edge in UWP then most construct 2 / 3 games should kill it...

but it seems they dont....... hmmmmm....

@scirra
@ashley

dont you think it would be prudent to remove the "export to xbox one" claim in Construct 3 advertising until plugins and everything else is in place and xbox UWP performance is validated and any limitations can be stated in a caveat against an export to xbox claim?


The 128MB limit on apps running in the background is a big issue and, really, the biggest game stopper with the stated limitations (performance is another issue and is Construct-specific, not platform or technology-specific), based on Construct's available functionality. Saying Construct 2 OR Construct 3 can export a functional, commercially-viable game to XB1 that would be allowed on the platform by Microsoft isn't true (again, at this time). Performance issues and current UWP limitations aside, neither support the feature set required to launch a game on XB1. I hadn't even realized that claim was being made about C3 but if it is, it's false advertising. It's simply not possible at this time.
Last edited by digitalsoapbox on Wed Jul 26, 2017 12:06 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 6:56 pm

Um, that didn't answer the question of why the 128mb restriction is important, or that it should even matter, as C2 games are not designed to run in background.

Also that last part about games development is kind of interesting.

If you're interested in making things work correctly, or that sort of thing, that is.
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Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:52 pm

newt wrote:Um, that didn't answer the question of why the 128mb restriction is important, or that it should even matter, as C2 games are not designed to run in background.



I'd imagine that because the C2/C3 games can't be forced to "release" memory when in background (no way to detect if running in background?) then you're only able to use 128MB at all times.

Running in the background is a Microsoft requirement however, as the player might go to HOME / SETTINGS / STORE / etc., which bring your app out of focus.
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Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:20 pm

If Scirra hasn't addressed that in the their code, then that would be a bug that needs to be reported.
Complaining, and making accusations of false advertising doesn't do anything.
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Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:15 pm

Yea. Technically it is still beta so "features may be missing" and Im sure ive seen Ashley say somewhere the live plug in is pretty much done so I think it is coming together.
To be honest I was surprised the UWP performance wasn't better but it wasn't atrocious I'm sure there are a lot of construct games that could work with it. I would very interested to see the performance boost enabled by signing up for the ID program. And This 128mb issue something that could probably be easily sorted. I'm so far away from anything like releasing on Xbox that I'm not to bothered though it is just interesting to tinker. (Wow I'm feeling positive today must be good coffee !) It sure would be nice to see Sombrero on live though. @digitalsoapbox you'll have to be the trailblazer on this one... Trailblazer , now that's a blast from the past... I was pro skills at that back in the day....
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Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:13 pm

I'm quite interested in seeing how this whole UWP export thing will (or will not) unfold. 8-)
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Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:21 pm

newt wrote:If Scirra hasn't addressed that in the their code, then that would be a bug that needs to be reported.
Complaining, and making accusations of false advertising doesn't do anything.


If they're saying the plugin is ready, that doesn't seem to be the case. If they're saying games can be deployed commercially, that's untrue. Missing features is not a "bug" - it's missing features. This is not a complicated statement.
Last edited by digitalsoapbox on Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post » Tue Jul 25, 2017 11:27 pm

NetOne wrote:Yea. Technically it is still beta so "features may be missing" and Im sure ive seen Ashley say somewhere the live plug in is pretty much done so I think it is coming together.
To be honest I was surprised the UWP performance wasn't better but it wasn't atrocious I'm sure there are a lot of construct games that could work with it. I would very interested to see the performance boost enabled by signing up for the ID program. And This 128mb issue something that could probably be easily sorted. I'm so far away from anything like releasing on Xbox that I'm not to bothered though it is just interesting to tinker. (Wow I'm feeling positive today must be good coffee !) It sure would be nice to see Sombrero on live though. @digitalsoapbox you'll have to be the trailblazer on this one... Trailblazer , now that's a blast from the past... I was pro skills at that back in the day....


There are currently no trails to blaze. It just isn't possible at this time. The 128MB issue - a requirement to deploy on the platform - is bigger than you think. That's really just a few sound files and sprites stored uncompressed in memory. Just LAUNCHING Sombrero takes about 300MB, and that's with loading most of the assets manually after start and nothing on the layout - just playing a video takes 300MB. If we had a way to reliably flush memory it may be less of an issue on startup, but memory issues aside that's still not taking into features that are required for XB1 games.
Last edited by digitalsoapbox on Mon Jul 31, 2017 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post » Wed Jul 26, 2017 3:29 am

digitalsoapbox wrote: Just LAUNCHING Sombrero takes about 300MB, and that's with loading most of the assets manually after start and nothing on the layout - just playing a video takes 300MB.

I could have sworn you had a video of Sombrero running on Xbox One and it was actually running quite smoothly....or was i mistaken and it was actually running on the PC?
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Post » Mon Jul 31, 2017 11:30 am

Edge is a great browser engine and is really high performance now. It's comparable to Chrome in the latest releases.

If XB1 is slow because of deliberate limitations by Microsoft - e.g. capping CPU usage - then there's nothing much we can do about that. It's not Construct's fault, and no other framework can get around that either, it's the XB1 OS that is capping apps that run on it. In that sense UWP apps will run exactly as well as Microsoft let them. This isn't anything to do with the performance of C2 or HTML5. It's the same thing if an app can only use 128mb RAM (which IIRC I've not seen any official reference for, would appreciate a link on that) - no other framework or technology is going to let you get around that, it's an XB1 issue, not a Construct issue. So the best people to go to about this would be Microsoft. FWIW you should already be able to detect backgrounded games (Browser plugin 'On suspended', 'On resumed', same as all other platforms), and you can try using the savegame system to do full state saves and restores to work around that too.
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